Only Some Vamp Plug-Ins (SV on Mac OSX 10.4.11)?

[Chuck_1]

Hi Folks,
I downloaded and installed three sets of Vamp Plug-Ins (VPIs) but only the 'example' set seems to work so far. The VPIs are:
1. QM Vamp Plug-Ins;
2. Vamp Aubio; and
3. Vamp-Example.

The location (on Mac OSX 10.4.11) I used is System(HD)/Lib/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/(Files) which is - if I understood correctly - the recommended location.

The files that I put in that location are always the two files: the dylib and the cat file for each VPI set. The only difference that I could discern between the sets is a veiled comment at the download site for the 'example' set (with the Software Developer Kit information) saying that the 'example' set has been especially set up to make it more easily recognizable by hosts.

Any ideas why only the 'example' set works or - more importantly - why the other two sets do not?

Thanks in advance - and congrats on a great job with SV!

[cannam]

Hi -- I'm afraid I don't have any immediate ideas about this; I wonder if you can get some more information from the host about why it can't load the plugins?

Do you have the vamp-simple-host program that comes with the SDK?  (I can't actually remember offhand whether it's distributed with the example plugins for OS/X or in a separate package.)  If so, try running "vamp-simple-host -l" (that's a lower-case L) from a terminal window to get a list of the installed plugins.  If that list doesn't contain the aubio and QM plugins, perhaps it will have printed an error that gives some hint as to why.

For what it's worth, the text that I think you're referring to in the SDK download page is describing a facility added to the SDK that makes it easier to write hosts that discover and load plugins (i.e. it takes less code to write the host), not that makes it easier for any given plugin to be discovered and loaded.  There shouldn't be any significant difference between the example plugins and any others in this respect.

By the way, is this an Intel or PPC Mac?


Chris

[Chuck_1]

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your helpful hints - here are my results so far (I once used to program in machine code and then in many other formats but it was a while ago... so I'd appreciate your patience with me!):

1. This is a PPC Mac: 1.25 GHz PowerPC G4 with 1 GB DDR SDRAM and more than 100 GB of free disk space.

2. You are absolutely correct about the text that I remembered from the SDK download page - it is: "designed to help hosts find and use plugins much more easily".

3. Here is what I had downloaded (and unzipped) before my first posting on this topic:

http://optusnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/sv1/sonic-visualiser-1.0-osx-universal.zip
http://www.elec.qmul.ac.uk/digitalmusic/downloads/qm-vamp-plugins-1.3-osx-universal.tar.gz
http://optusnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/vamp/vamp-example-plugins-1.1b-osx-universal.tar.gz

And after reading your reply - since I could not find the vamp-simple-host program that you mentioned - I then also downloaded (and unzipped) this (which contains it):

http://optusnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/vamp/vamp-plugin-sdk-1.1b-binaries-osx-universal.tar.gz

4. Thus on my desktop I now have a folder entitled: "vamp-plugin-sdk-1.1b-binaries-osx-universal" which contains the following six items:

libvamp-hostsdk.a
libvamp-hostsdk.dylib
libvamp-sdk.a
libvamp-sdk.dylib
README.txt
vamp-simple-host

5. When I tried to run "vamp-simple-host -l" from a terminal window I got the following result:

Last login: Sun Jan 13 16:33:53 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ vamp-simple-host -l
-bash: vamp-simple-host: command not found
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$

I then tried two other commands (-p and -v) and got the following - probably not surprising - results:

Last login: Sun Jan 13 17:30:26 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ vamp-simple-host -p
-bash: vamp-simple-host: command not found
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$

Last login: Sun Jan 13 17:30:52 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ vamp-simple-host -v
-bash: vamp-simple-host: command not found
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$

This all suggests to me that maybe I need to do more than simply have the vamp-simple-host program sitting in a folder on my desktop - maybe I should 'install' it (and perhaps other items, too) but if so... exactly how... and where?

6. By the way, the example plugins that do already seem to work for me - they are the only ones that appear so far in the 'Transform' tab of 'Sonic Visualiser' - are located (from my earlier downloading) on the desktop in a folder entitled: "vamp-example-plugins-1.1b-osx-universal" but I had already also copied them from there into my /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp folder (as recommended for OSX). The two files (versions from 19 October 2007) are:

vamp-example-plugins.cat
vamp-example-plugins.dylib

7. If there is any more information that might help you to assist me, please do not hesitate to tell me and I'll do my best to find and provide it! Thanks for your patience!

Cheers, Charles


 

[cannam]

Charles,

I think the "command not found" is probably simple enough -- I imagine it's just that the current working directory is not in your command path.  So, instead of running

$ vamp-simple-host -l

try running

$ ./vamp-simple-host -l

with the "./" at the start telling the command shell to run the program in the current directory instead of looking for it in your path.


Chris

[Chuck_1]

Hi Chris,
Thanks for your help. I tried your suggestion two ways:

1. Without starting Sonic Visualizer, I opened Terminal and ran the command with the ./ as suggested. Here is my result:

Last login: Fri Jan 18 17:57:12 on console
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ ./vamp-simple-host -l
-bash: ./vamp-simple-host: No such file or directory
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$

2. After starting Sonic Visualiser, I repeated the process and unfortunately the result was the same.

Probably it is a case of 'thick as two short planks' but I get the feeling that I am missing something simple but vital! Could it be something to do with this:

"maybe I need to do more than simply have the vamp-simple-host program sitting in a folder on my desktop - maybe I should 'install' it (and perhaps other items, too) - but if so... exactly how... and where?" 

Thanks again for your patience - and your assistance.

Cheers, Charles

[cannam]

Charles,

Sorry, I had overlooked the fact that your earlier message said vamp-simple-host was in a folder on your desktop (as opposed to your home folder).  It doesn't need to be installed, as such, but to run it from the terminal you need to tell the shell where to run it from: the "./" in our command told the shell to run it from the "current directory", i.e. your home folder which is where the terminal window starts up by default.  If you just copy the vamp-simple-host file to your home folder, you should be able to run it then.

Note that vamp-simple-host has nothing to do with Sonic Visualiser except that it uses the same plugins, so it shouldn't matter whether SV is running or not.


Chris

[Chuck_1]

Hi Chris,
Thanks again... and this time... progress (of sorts)! Taking on board your clarification about vamp-simple-host and SV, all of the following was done while Sonic Visualiser was NOT running.

1. Here is what I got when I copied the file 'vamp-simple-host' into my Home Folder and then ran Terminal (with the command $ ./vamp-simple-host -l as you suggested):

Last login: Sat Jan 19 10:33:11 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$  ./vamp-simple-host -l

Vamp plugin search path: [/Users/albertcharlesmonticone/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp][/library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp]

Vamp plugin libraries found in search path:
Vamp::HostExt::PluginLoader: Unable to load library "/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib": dlopen(/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib, 1): Library not loaded: /var/tmp//cc04tfVL.out
  Referenced from: /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib
  Reason: image not found
Vamp::HostExt::PluginLoader: Unable to load library "/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/vamp-aubio.dylib": dlopen(/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/vamp-aubio.dylib, 1): no suitable image found.  Did find:
        /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/vamp-aubio.dylib: mach-o, but wrong architecture
Illegal instruction
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$                   


Unfortunately, these results did not give me any inspiration. However - just in case additional results might help you - I also ran similar commands (-p and -v) with the following results:

2. Using ./vamp-simple-host -p

Last login: Sat Jan 19 10:39:20 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ ./vamp-simple-host -p
/Users/albertcharlesmonticone/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp
/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$


3. Using ./vamp-simple-host -v

Last login: Sat Jan 19 10:40:45 on ttyp1
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ ./vamp-simple-host -v
Simple Vamp plugin host version: 1.1
Vamp API version: 1
Vamp SDK version: 1.1
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$


4. This is what is in the
Macintosh HD/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp Folder (that is, from the System Library):

vamp-example-plugins.dylib
vamp-aubio.cat
vamp-aubio.dylib
vamp-example-plugins.cat
qm-vamp-plugins.cat
qm-vamp-plugins.dylib


5. By way of contrast - especially if it helps - here is what is in the
Macintosh HD/Users/albertcharlesmonticone/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins Folder (that is, from my own User Library and NO Vamp):

Digidesign
VST
Components

Please note: Amongst (or within) these three - currently empty - Folders, there is NO Vamp Folder and there are NO Vamp Files.
I wonder if there should be, since the results from the ./vamp-simple-host -p command (par. 2 above) included the following text:

/Users/albertcharlesmonticone/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp
/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp

Does that mean that the vamp-simple-host expected to find something (like Vamp Plug-Ins) there in my User area?


6. I hope that the results above, particularly from the first command (./vamp-simple-host -l), give you some insight as to why my Sonic Visualiser does not (yet) recognize the QM and Aubio Vamp Plug-Ins despite the fact that it does recognize the 'example' Vamp Plug-Ins. If there is more I can do to clarify the situation, please let me know! 

Thanks again for your patient and valuable help.
Cheers, Charles

[cannam]

Thanks Charles -- I think that's enough to go on to establish why the plugins aren't working.  We're due to make a new release of the QM plugin set any day now, so I'll try to ensure that this problem is fixed.

For the Aubio set, do you have a record (or recollection) of exactly which package you downloaded and installed?  The latest build for OS/X was vamp-aubio-plugins-0.3.2b.1-osx-universal.tar.gz available from http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=192001 -- if this is not exactly the same version as you already installed (noting carefully the ".1" in "0.3.2b.1"), then I'd suggest installing that one to see if it makes any difference for you.

Finally, yes, both vamp-simple-host and Sonic Visualiser look for plugins in both a "global" location (the one beginning with /Library) and the equivalent user-specific location (the one beneath your home folder).  You can place Vamp plugins in either of these locations and they should work, although you should always be careful to avoid having the same plugin in both places (because it wouldn't be easy to know which was being used, and that might be problematic if they were ever not of the same version).

Thanks for your persistence -- please watch this space for the update to the QM plugin set.


Chris

[Chuck_1]

Hi Chris,
Thanks to your attention to detail...More progress!

1. The version I had for Aubio was without the ".1" but having removed the earlier version and then downloaded and tested that latest version, it works - wonderfully well - so thanks and congratulations!


2. Just in case it helps, here is what I now get when I run the command $ ./vamp-simple-host -l in Terminal:

Last login: Thu Jan 24 17:42:06 on console
Welcome to Darwin!
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$ ./vamp-simple-host -l

Vamp plugin search path: [/Users/albertcharlesmonticone/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp][/library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp]

Vamp plugin libraries found in search path:
Vamp::HostExt::PluginLoader: Unable to load library "/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib": dlopen(/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib, 1): Library not loaded: /var/tmp//cc04tfVL.out
  Referenced from: /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Vamp/qm-vamp-plugins.dylib
  Reason: image not found
Illegal instruction
localhost:~ albertcharlesmonticone$

So as you can see, Aubio has now dropped out of the list of 'Unable to load library' items. Thanks!


3. I have all my Vamp Plug-Ins in the "global" location and I appreciate why it is logical to have them in only one place (thanks again).


4. I am very much looking forward to the new release of the QM Vamp Plug-Ins. I hope that my problems - and your valuable help - will make it a bit easier for some other (lucky!) user(s) too. It is excellent work that you folks are doing and it will be very helpful for me in programming lighting for dance productions at the local community theatre - especially when the community dance company are kind enough to give me advance copies of their planned music. (I also have an amateur academic interest in music and for this, your work gives all sorts of fascinating insights!)

Thanks again and Cheers, Charles

[cannam]

Charles,

The new 1.4 release of the QM plugins is now available from the usual download site (see also the announcement in the announcements forum here!)

Please let me know if you run into any problems with these.

Thanks!


Chris

[Chuck_1]

Hi Chris,
Thanks for all your help. I just downloaded the 1.4 release and each of the transforms that I tested (about half of them, so far) worked perfectly for me.
Congratulations (again!) and thanks again!
Cheers, Charles